Kathleen Widmer, Class of ’83 and Distinguished Graduate Award honoree, shares how early leadership lessons at West Point and in the military shaped her rise to the executive ranks of Johnson & Johnson. Her story is a compelling exploration of pioneering through adversity, championing women’s athletics, and leading with humanity across industries.
In this episode of the WPAOG Podcast, we sit down with Kathleen Widmer, class of 1983, and a 2025 Distinguished Graduate Award honoree. From helping launch the Women’s Lacrosse team as a cadet to leading in both the military and private sector, Widmer shares powerful stories of perseverance, leadership, and service. Her journey reflects a deep commitment to others and a belief that real leadership starts with humility and humanity.
Widmer’s path is defined by lifelong service and standout leadership — from breaking barriers as one of West Point’s early women graduates and a pioneering field artillery battery commander, to shaping healthcare access as a senior executive at Johnson & Johnson. She was instrumental in forming the Women’s Lacrosse Team at the Academy, led veteran hiring programs in corporate America, and helped restore the Wounded Warrior Project as board chair. Through it all, she’s remained a committed supporter of West Point, exemplifying the values of the Long Gray Line across every chapter of her life.
Listeners will gain insight into how West Point prepared her for command and crisis leadership, how she led teams through the pandemic and major corporate transformations, and why she believes the most effective leaders lead with their humanity. This episode is a must-listen for professionals, leaders, and cadets who want to learn what it truly means to lead with impact.
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Key Quote:
“ The other thing that West Point really did for me that helped me in industry is you build stamina at West Point. You don't get to opt out of hard stuff. You have to do everything. You have to get up every day early. You have to follow a schedule that puts too many things in front of you to do, then you can actually accomplish, and you have to filter all the time what's important and focus on those things. And, you know, being a senior leader in industry is the same. If you try to do everything instead of prioritizing and filtering, and figuring out. What's important, you, you just sort of run yourself in circles. And honestly, don't accomplish much. But there's a, there's a stamina that you build at West Point, and it's the same kind of stamina that I think you have to have in industry to be, every 30 minutes somebody's giving you dense, complex information that you need to make a decision about. And then 30 minutes later, it's a completely different topic, and they're doing the same thing. And then it's the next 30 minutes, and it's sort of like you need to train for it, and West Point prepares you for that.”
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Episode Timestamps:
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View all of the 2025 Distinguished Graduate Award Nominees
0:00:01.8 Announcer : Welcome to the WPAOG podcast. Today's guest is Kathleen Widmer, West Point class of '83 and 2025 Distinguished Graduate Award recipient. A trailblazer in the Army's field artillery branch, she went on to lead at the highest levels of Johnson and Johnson, chair the Wounded Warrior Project and and champion veteran employment, all while remaining a steadfast supporter of the Academy. Please enjoy this episode with our host, Jamie Enos.
0:00:40.0 Jamie Enos: Kathy, welcome to the WPAOG podcast. It is a pleasure to have you on today.
0:00:45.2 Kathleen Widmer: Thanks for having me. It's just a pleasure to be here, and I'm really looking forward to it.
0:00:49.3 Jamie Enos: I think everybody's all surprised. They think, like, "Oh, I'm on WPAOG podcast." Like, this is something I never imagined as a cadet or even as a grad. Like, what is this thing that we have now as AOG? And so we're just really grateful when grads were like, yeah, we'll come on and have this conversation. So, appreciate your time and taking it out for us and going to share some stories today. But first, congratulations on receiving the Distinguished Graduate Award from AOG this year with class of 2025.
0:01:17.3 Kathleen Widmer: It was quite the honor. Thanks very much.
0:01:19.3 Jamie Enos: Yeah. Your class was really rallied behind you. That class of '83. And I mean, your class is a huge, I mean, what a power class that is too. And you're just one more member of that. So, big congratulations from that. But you come from a military family. Your dad, John, was also a West Point grad, class of 1959. Is that?
0:01:37.8 Kathleen Widmer: That's right.
0:01:38.5 Jamie Enos: Okay. So, you decided to come to West Point. Can you take us back to that moment that you decided to come and what motivated that decision?
0:01:48.2 Kathleen Widmer: Sure. So, as you mentioned, my dad was a class of '59 graduates. I will say that in the years that I was in high school, when women were first admitted to the academies, he was absolutely not a fan of women going to the service academies. And he was also military academy liaison officer. So he worked with local high school boys to help them get their applications in and sort of built their resumes to attend one of the military academies. And I used to listen to him talk to these boys and kind of give them advice in terms of what they needed to do. And I always had in the back of my mind that I was already doing those things or I could do those things. And he had a hardship tour, one year hardship tour to Korea when we were living in Maryland. And when he was gone, I put my application in to West Point. And back then when you had a service member in Korea or abroad, you would send an APO airmail letter to him. So, I send him an airmail letter and let him know that I put an application in. And it was kind of crickets for a while. And by the way, he very quickly became my single biggest supporter. But I think those classes back in those years, it was a tough adjustment. It was a tough assessment for my dad. So I didn't go to West Point to antagonize my dad but I've always felt like a little jolt of motivation toward any opportunity that seems out of reach.
0:03:23.4 Jamie Enos: I love it.
0:03:24.6 Kathleen Widmer: I'm sure Shrink could have a field day with this. But if you tell me that something is beyond my capability or out of reach, it's like rolling the red carpet out for me and then I'm all in. So that was what this was. It was something that felt like a big challenge. Slightly out of reach, maybe not for me. And I really don't think I was looking pretty very far down the line. I was really just looking to see if I could actually get in. And then when I got into the academy, then I was just determined to see if I could graduate. And it was just kind of one step after another. But there was no grand plan for a long term career in the military. It was one step at a time.
0:04:05.2 Jamie Enos: That's incredible. I mean, wow. And I didn't realize that your dad was a little bit hesitant at first with the idea of you coming. That's kind of...
0:04:13.3 Kathleen Widmer: Hesitant is a word. But that's not. He was more than hesitant. He had eventually got an airmail letter back with all of the reasons why it was "not for me." And like I said, that was like cat to me. Like, then I wanted to go even more.
0:04:30.8 Jamie Enos: That's cool. That's great. So you come to R-day in the summer of '79.
0:04:35.1 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah.
0:04:35.3 Jamie Enos: And do you remember that? You remember your R-day?
0:04:37.9 Kathleen Widmer: Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. I remember my parents were there, my sisters, my high school boyfriend. My mother bawled her eyes out when we were saying goodbye in Michie Stadium. I remember my first salute. I remember the cadet in the red sash. I had got my hair, back then we had a really, really short haircuts and women did come into the academy. And I had had like waist long hair pretty much my whole life. And the week before that I got the shortest possible haircut hoping that it would last as long as possible without Barry Barber, because I didn't know what they were going to do. And then we marched in the parade that afternoon, and it was, we took the oath, and it was just kind of it's a surreal day. So much happens in one day, and you kind of feel like you entered a mixing bowl and then you pop out and you're something completely different at the end of 24 hours or 12 hours, whatever it was.
0:05:33.8 Jamie Enos: Yeah. And you start all those friendships from minute zero and go on from there. And you did. You graduated with the class of '83. Proud to be. It's the saying, I see it all over, especially now with you at the DGA. They are very, very supportive and so proud of you. Were there any moments during your time at the Academy that tested that resolve while you were here?
0:05:58.8 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah. And I'll be candid about those early years, they were a lot of things for women. I think it was an honor to be in those classes.
0:06:08.0 Jamie Enos: Sure.
0:06:08.8 Kathleen Widmer: Excruciating to be in those classes. It was some of the best memories of my life. And it was hard. Like, it was all those things. It was a lot. And the one thing that I think tested my resolve most of the time that I was at school was that being a woman in those early classes was very much like being in a fishbowl. And I hear this from lots of women who were there with me during those years. Whether it was Academy staff or it was other cadets or it was the media, There was always kind of eyes on you. And you could be walking into a room, walking out of a room, walking across the area. I just always had this feeling of being watched closely. And it's understandable. It was novel. It was new. Everybody had an opinion one way or the other. But I think the thing that I regret about it was I sort of feel like I withdrew a little bit. It was just that feeling, like you're being watched all the time. And so the thing I regret about it was I think I had golden opportunities then to form closer bonds with other people, like the members of my class, like lots of women across the Academy.
0:07:21.4 Kathleen Widmer: But I think that experience in those early years caused me, and not just me, like other other women I know as well, to withdraw a bit. And the thing I'm grateful for is in all the years since, that there are plenty of years and plenty of opportunities to build those bonds, which I have. And they're gold to me now, like those are the closest friendships of my life are within my family and my classmates. And I really appreciate them. But I think those years were. If there's anything that tested my resolve, it was a fishbowl.
0:07:53.0 Jamie Enos: Yeah. That's understandable. That microscope, I guess that you're just constantly, can you survive? Will you do it? What's the standard? Are you exceeding it? Are you maintaining it and going through it? That's a lot of pressure.
0:08:04.2 Kathleen Widmer: Looking back on it, I completely understand. It was such a cultural shift that you're kind of earning a grade all the time. And it makes common sense to me now, but it was strange. It was strange then.
0:08:21.1 Jamie Enos: Yeah. I think we often think about influencing West Point in adulthood. I talk to a lot of grads and we talk about like after they've graduated and how they've influenced West Point. But when I read your story and I think about the things that you've done and I think about how you influenced West Point when you were actually a cadet. And I'm talking about the Women's Lacrosse Program. And it might sound like a minor thing of like getting this thing off the ground and rallying everybody into this club program, then, in the '80s. But I don't think people understand is how many women came through that program that became these incredible leaders, not only in the military, but in corporate America and in society. And they were members of that women's lacrosse team. And now here we have, spanning the years, and that team is now an NCAA Division 1 sport. It's in the running for league championships almost every year now. Is looking for playoff spots and going to the NCAAs. It's national rankings, several years now running. And we've got even players in the national pool looking at the national team and possibly even playing in the Olympics in 2028. And I saw this photo of you, which I think was pretty recent because you were standing next to Bridget Duffy on the field. And I was just like, look at this smile from ear to ear, this grin of this proud mama moment of this thing that you had developed and how it's come to fruition. Can you just describe that impact as a cadet and then how you've carried that forward even now into adulthood?
0:10:04.7 Kathleen Widmer: When I went to school there. So I got there in '79. In '79, in the US, you either needed to be from Long island or Baltimore to have played Lacrosse, and men and women. It was really, those were the two hotbeds. And I was living right outside of Baltimore, went to a Catholic school. Everybody played lacrosse. And so when I got to school, I remember an upper class woman asking me what sports I played in high school. And I told her I played lacrosse. And she's like, you played lacrosse? And she said, we are trying to form a team and we have no one to play. And I said, well, why wouldn't you form a team where somebody's played the sport before? So, why are you in this one? And it's just they just wanted to play it. So, I went around to my friends, my roommates, the girls I knew, and just tried to drum up a handful of women who wanted to learn. And I think for the first couple of years, maybe it was year four or five, before there was another. There was another woman cadet there who had played in high school.
0:11:13.2 Kathleen Widmer: And I'll tell you what, it's so impressive that I would say year one was a lot of learning curve. But by year two, we were beating teams in our league. And that was with women who hadn't picked up a lacrosse stick 12 months prior to that. And they're great athletes, assertive, competitive, and quickly picking up stick skills. So it was really, really fun to play with them. And that became my community. That was where I think we all enjoyed being together. We all enjoyed traveling together. And it was a club sport at the time. And you just watch the evolution of this and the team and Michelle Tumolo and how strong they are, and it's a thrill to just stand next to them. And that particular photo I think you're talking about, I think that was Army Navy this year where they shoveled. I think they shoveled a half a foot of snow off of Michie Stadium field in order for them to play. It was just a fluke that it snowed. And I remember telling them, I'm like, this is army weather. This is your house. Let's go. And they're just those girls are, first of all, they're awesome human beings, but just fantastic athletes and so competitive. And I think they were up seven to nothing in 12 minutes. They just went out and tore it up. It was awesome.
0:12:34.5 Jamie Enos: Yeah. Exactly. I was telling this story. I was telling this little, this lacrosse story, just so you know, I was telling the story about that and like Donna Brazile and all that. All these wonderful women that came through. Like, literally you start googling, who played lacrosse? And women soccer is the other one too, but it's actually, women's lacrosse has got a couple more names that are a little bit more recognizable. And we started the women's ice hockey club team this year, as officially.
0:13:01.6 Kathleen Widmer: Oh, nice.
0:13:02.6 Jamie Enos: And we were telling them the same story, and it's like, and that's how we built the team. Like, oh, you came to here to West Point, you don't have figure skates, and you figured skate, great, now you're an ice hockey player. Oh, you used to play field hockey, now you're an ice hockey player.
0:13:14.8 Kathleen Widmer: Yes. Exactly. Exactly. But the thing that was back then when these teams... They were probably 10 or fewer women's athletic teams, because we just weren't enough women. And I wasn't trying to talk them out of lacrosse because I love lacrosse, but I was like, why would you not pick this sport that so many have played? Like, field hockey was one of them. There were a decent number of women who played field hockey. But in any case, I'm glad it turned out to be lacrosse because it's such an awesome sport. And you think of like, Jane Gelada, Sharon Reardon, Jeanette Reagan, they were great women on that team. And we still are, and we're still close.
0:13:57.6 Jamie Enos: That's great. How do you stay connected to the Long Gray Line?
0:14:01.8 Kathleen Widmer: So, we live up here in the Northeast. We live in Bucks County, Pennsylvania. So, we pretty much join virtually everything that's on offer, either for our class or in army athletics. So we're seasoned ticket holders. So we're up there for every game. Bob and I, my husband's class of '83 as well, we've twice chaired reunions for our class. And so that keeps you pretty tightly woven in. And I also think that it is one of the nice advantages of being married to someone who's also a classmate. So it brings his entire circle of classmates that he knew, plus a circle of people that I knew. So it just kind of doubles the number of cadets that you're close to or graduates that you're close to. And we put some time and effort and resources into West Point. We're fortunate to be in a position where we can do that, and it means a lot to both of us. And so when it comes to where we put our time, where we place our resources, it is at the very top of our list.
0:15:07.6 Jamie Enos: Well, we appreciate that. That's for sure. Because I do know that it's not just you're speaking at speaker series here and you're visiting, like we were talking about earlier, the lacrosse games. And you're at West Point often, your face is known, people can find you walking around campus a lot.
0:15:25.3 Kathleen Widmer: They are all over...
0:15:28.6 Jamie Enos: In a good way. In a good way. It's great. It's great. We love it. And on the road too, like, you're not just coming up to West Point too, you're support out and about.
0:15:37.6 Kathleen Widmer: Out on the road, which is always fun. And two of my three daughters live up in Westchester, New York now. And so, in the next couple of years, we're going to be moving up there. So, it'll get even worse. I'll be everywhere. But it'll give me the opportunity to like, we're up for every football game, we're up for women's lacrosse games, but it would give us the opportunity to do a whole lot more. So we're looking forward to being up there.
0:16:00.1 Jamie Enos: That's great. All right. Well, let's go back to the career part. When we look at your career, Johnson and Johnson, the work with Wounded Warrior Project, Texas Roadhouse, what leadership lessons did you learn from West Point that stayed with you throughout your life and your career, and how did that shape you as a leader and a person?
0:16:21.9 Kathleen Widmer: So definitely, West Point definitely played a major role in leadership for me over the long term and leadership in my career. I'm going to be candid. This is something that I've shared many times because that question of, like, how has West Point shaped you as a leader? Comes up a lot.
0:16:42.4 Jamie Enos: Sure.
0:16:43.0 Kathleen Widmer: And I think people are often a little surprised by my initial answer. And you do learn this at West Point, I always say, job one, don't be an A***. It really. And if you can avoid being an A*** you're 70% of the way there. You really are. And when I say that, I mean things that are taught at West Point that aren't necessarily instinctive for everyone or for every leader. Things like when something goes wrong, that the leader is the first one to take accountability and if things go right, they're the first ones to recognize their team versus the other way around. There are just some basic core things that set you apart that are largely common sense but not instinctive for everyone. And so I feel like if you can do that, that takes you a lot of the way there.
0:17:32.6 Kathleen Widmer: And the second that I feel like I learned over the years and I also think that West Point engenders this as well, probably matters even more when you're a very senior leader that you find opportunities for your humanity to shine through. Because people follow people, they don't follow job titles. And that means staying humble, asking questions, being a great listener, keeping an ear to the ground, really understanding what the culture is, what the climate is. And I think that concept of humanity, like when I think of the best leaders that I know and the ones where you... You sort of know when you're in the presence of a great leader, to me that's a common thread, is their humanity comes through. And in a way that I think often surprises people, they expect a four star general or a leader in industry to be out of reach, out of touch, on a pedestal. And the best ones that I know are human and they let that humanity shine through. And I think the experience at West Point really supports that.
0:18:49.1 Jamie Enos: Do you think that's because it shows everybody's flaws as well?
0:18:53.2 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah. I do. And I think that that connects you to people. If you can admit a mistake, if you are sharing that you're constantly learning too. And when you share those experiences with others, they will tell you the things you need to know because they know you're human. They know you're human, that you're flawed. And so it's okay for them to be flawed as well. And I think it creates the right kind of connection so you actually understand what's truly happening. And you don't find those things out sitting in a boardroom or sitting in a briefing room. That's a walking around kind of leadership characteristic. And I think you're right. The more you're open to sharing losses as well as wins, it creates the kind of a connection with a leader that is unique.
0:19:43.9 Jamie Enos: Yeah. You had a lot of pressure even when you graduated. You were one of the early women to enter combat arms, branching field artillery and later becoming a battery commander. How did you handle that pressure, being a trailblazer and impacting your leadership and your philosophy on that?
0:20:03.9 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah. So first of all, being a battery commander, I was at Fort Sill after we graduated and that's the best job I've ever had, bar none. And that's such a unique experience, whether it's a full career in the military or it's a mix of military and industry, I thought that was the best job that I'd ever had. But by the time I got to Fort Sill I was used to being one of the only women. So I didn't feel like a trailblazer there. It was a bit of like an extension of my experience at West Point. I just wanted to do a good job. And the professionals who were around me, particularly when I was a battery commander, they were tough but fair. And so, it was an extraordinary experience for me. And as you know, I grew up in the military. I loved that job. That was the last position I held before I left the military to move into industry. And it was a tough call. It was a very tough call to leave and to decide to do that because of how great that job was.
0:21:13.9 Jamie Enos: Yeah. And so you transitioned from there into some of the highest levels in the private sector, Johnson and Johnson. So, why do you think that West Point foundation helped you lead there in that global environment and then later under the pandemic environment of everything that was coming at you? I'm sure under that.
0:21:33.8 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah. I think West Point and experiences in the military, they give you such a leg up as a leader. And there are so many ways that that's true, but the concept of having being steady under pressure, sometimes I have felt over the years that the worse the situation was, the harder the task or the crisis that we were in, you kind of instinctively become calm. When I get excitable, when everything's status quo and it feels like nobody understands that something's around the corner. But when those tough moments happen, it's great to be the one who's steady and calm. And people need to see that because the level of ajit is always way up. And I just think that being put to the test often just kind of, it builds that muscle. And the other thing that West Point really did for me, that helped me in industry is you build stamina at West Point. You don't get to opt out of hard stuff. You have to do everything. You have to get up every day early. You have to follow a schedule that puts too many things in front of you to do than you can actually accomplish. And you have to filter all the time what's important and focus on those things and being a senior leader in industry is the same.
0:23:01.2 Kathleen Widmer: If you try to do everything, instead of prioritizing and filtering and figuring out what's important, you just sort of run yourself in circles, and honestly, you don't accomplish much. But there's a stamina that you build at West Point and it's the same kind of stamina that I think you have to have in industry to be... Every 30 minutes, somebody's giving you dense, complex information that you need to make a decision about. And then 30 minutes later, it's a completely different topic and they're doing the same thing. And then it's the next in the next 30 minutes and. And it's sort of like you need to train for it, and West Point prepares you for that.
0:23:42.3 Jamie Enos: So, when you think about success then, how do you define that? Like you got the grading card and the report card in your class or on the military Battlefield or what have you of how you did? How do you define success either in the boardroom or now as you're transitioning into, I get more board member and out of the CEO positions. How do you define that success then? What do you look for?
0:24:05.8 Kathleen Widmer: So, years ago, when I was at J and J, we had a partnership with an organization called the Human Performance Institute. It's a great organization that was down in Orlando at the time. And they go through this exercise where you have about a half a day to figure out what are your priorities in life. And it's interesting that I can't tell you how many times I've been in a priority setting environment, but I never spend time on, yeah, but what are my priorities? What am I actually trying to do with the time I have here? And it was very deep. People were in tears. It was just this very kind of existential experience of figuring out what's important to you. And there was a magic number of three. All of us had to have at least three priorities in our life. And this was when I was pretty senior leader in the organization, but still had probably 10 years to go. And you would think that my career would have been in the top three priorities, but it wasn't. I think that the priorities that I came up with with were that whoever means most to me in my life, that I wanted to give them the best version of me.
0:25:17.9 Kathleen Widmer: And one of the reasons I came to that priority was when you're In a tough job, sometimes the job gets the best of you. And whoever's at home or whoever else is in your circle, they kind of take what's left. And so I wanted whoever mattered the most to me to get the best. So that was one. Another one was that I wanted to constantly improve myself. And then the last was, to be grateful and to give back. So if you ask me what success means to me now, I think of it in the context of those things. If I'm doing well against those priorities, I feel successful. But when I was younger, when I was a cadet or soon after I graduated, I think my concept of success was serial achievement. I want to achieve one thing, then I want to achieve another thing, and I want to achieve another thing, which I think is great. But I think over time, I put it in the context of what matters most to me, and those are the things that matter most.
0:26:23.0 Jamie Enos: Yeah. It's a lot of time management. It goes back to what you were saying about the stamina almost, of how to balance all of that and the priorities, because like you said, it's got the work and then who's getting it at home. And you had a spouse, you had a family with children. So you're getting pulled in all these different directions at the same time. And that stamina probably came through there too. And how...
0:26:45.6 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah. And I think it's not like I certainly wasn't able to deliver perfectly on those priorities all the time. There were days when the wheels come off or the house of cards comes crashing down, and then you just get up the next day and do the best you can against them. But like, on the whole, I wanted to feel like I spent my time and my effort on the things that really mattered, and my career and my time in the military really mattered, but those are also people who mattered a lot to me. So, in the context of who's getting my best, it was like my team at work, I wanted them to get my best. Now, somebody else's team down the road might not get my best because I only have so much capacity. But it was all in that context of trying to be a little deliberate about it.
0:27:33.5 Jamie Enos: Yeah. But I think that also goes back to your other comma about being human and recognizing that, like, you only have so much bandwidth and that's really a great quality that you have. When I look at you and I think about it and I'm like, yeah, that's relatable. And I appreciate that, you saying that and me being able to hear that as well. But are there any books or mentors specifically that anybody was like, that one person was, that was the wow factor. I mean, that experience at J and J sounds like it was one of the wow factors. Are there any people that pop out to you or books or?
0:28:09.9 Kathleen Widmer: Well, he wrote one of the nomination for the Distinguished Graduate packet for me, and it was...
0:28:17.5 Jamie Enos: One of the four dozen we should add. There were so many. I don't know if we're done reading them yet, but there is a gigantic list. You did not get nominated by some lack of qualifications, that's for sure.
0:28:33.4 Kathleen Widmer: Yeah. And by the way, that process, when you go through that process, it connected me back with my brigade commander from when I was a battery commander, somebody who is a West Point graduate who I hadn't seen or heard from. And he reached out. So the process is actually really wonderful. But it was General Stan McChrystal who, he came to speak to a bunch of senior leaders at J and J when I was there. And then shortly after that, he offered for me to come to Alexandria to the McChrystal Group, his office as well as his home, with very few other people. I think in the end there were maybe three or four of us who had the opportunity to get personal time and attention and mentoring from General McChrystal. And first of all, like I said before, when you're in the presence of a great leader, he had that perfect humanity. He's a great listener. He's inherently a humble person. His team of teams concept has been put to practice in so many places and I leverage that at work to some pretty good success.
0:29:43.4 Kathleen Widmer: But one of the things that really stuck with me there was one of the mornings in DC, he and his command sergeant major from when he was on active duty, went for a run with a couple of us before the sun was coming up on the Mall. And so, they ran us from monument to monument. And along the way his command sergeant major knew like little known facts about each of the monuments and the history behind them. And it left such an impression on me. It was a little bit of history. It was running alongside one of the greatest leaders of our time and that he was human and his wife was amazing. And we had dinner at their home. And his home backs up. It was a townhome that backs up to his son's home with his grandchildren there. It left an incredible impression. And part of it was his humanity, and part of it was what I learned from him that I was able to put to practice in business.
0:30:45.0 Jamie Enos: Well, love the fact that it's a fellow West Point grad, of course.
0:30:48.4 Kathleen Widmer: Yes.
0:30:49.2 Jamie Enos: Yeah. An incredible example that you've given. We've had him on the podcast as well, so listeners can also hear more about him from our podcast. You will be podcast number 99, though, Kathy. So congratulations on that.
0:31:02.8 Kathleen Widmer: Oh, wow. Congratulations to you for doing that.
0:31:05.6 Jamie Enos: Yeah. So, this is really a special treat, again. You did, we all know you had recently gotten the DGA award. How did you find out about that? You talked a little bit about the nomination process, but how did you even find out? And then, I heard that the class reacted and was totally celebratory, of course. What did that mean when you found out?
0:31:29.8 Kathleen Widmer: So, somebody gave me a little bit of inside baseball information about that, and they said that sometime in January, you're either going to get a call from Mark Berger, who is president of the AOG, which means that you did get selected, or you're going to get a phone call from your class president, which means you did not get selected. So I said, okay.
0:31:50.1 Jamie Enos: 50-50. Here we go.
0:31:51.9 Kathleen Widmer: So Bob and I, one day in January, we were driving up to have dinner with our kids, and Mark Berger's name came over on the phone in the car. And of course, it's an honor, and it feels awesome. I personally think my class is unique. I'm sure everybody does. But I think the class of '83 and the class leadership are exceptional human beings who are in service to each other and show up for each other. So, it was great. What was a little less awesome was that on the way up to the ceremony for distinguished graduate, my appendix ruptured on the way up there. And so I never made it to the ceremony. We ended up in a Westchester hospital having surgery instead. And so Mark reached out to me and he said, we feel really bad about what happened. And I said, I feel really bad about it too, because all these people came and I no-showed, but I'm going to jump in with a group who is honored in 2026, which I really appreciate the opportunity to do it. But it's an incredible honor, especially when you look at the quality of people who have been distinguished graduates in the past. And I'm extremely appreciative of the people who put the nominations in, but my class and the class committee are amazing people.
0:33:08.5 Jamie Enos: Yeah. And for our listeners, if you would like to see some photos of Kathy and a little bit more of her bio, we do have a little YouTube video of that out on our YouTube channel at WPAOG that you can see more about that and also a recap of the ceremony that she was missing from. But hopefully next year will be in attendance at as well.
0:33:29.7 Kathleen Widmer: Talk about bad timing, right?
0:33:31.7 Jamie Enos: Yeah. It's just part of the game. It is what it is and we did miss you but we are glad that your health is restored and that everything's back on the mend and we're full steam ahead.
0:33:42.0 Kathleen Widmer: Right. Okay.
0:33:43.2 Jamie Enos: But like I said, you've been around West Point, you've been at the speaker series and you've been very active around here. But do you have any last minute advice that you would give to those cadets, the current generation of cadets?
0:33:58.0 Kathleen Widmer: So, when I think of this and where they are in their lives and if you have any contact with cadets, first of all, they're so incredibly impressive. Honestly, I say this in all candor, so much more impressive than I remember being at that time in my life. They're dialed in and it's really, really great to spend time with them. It's incredibly reassuring. But I think if I were going to give any advice, I would give the same advice that I would give anyone who has sort of lived through an era of both the pandemic and a heavy social media era. And that is, it's a bit of a common thread for me, but it's cultivate your humanity as a leader. I think social media and the pandemic sort of can conspire against that a bit. And you need to give direct feedback, eye to eye, demonstrate compassion and empathy and excitement and encouragement. And I have an expression that I like to use, that you should be a heads up leader versus a heads down leader. A heads up leader is eye to eye with other people, sharing humanity with other people.
0:35:13.3 Kathleen Widmer: Heads down in technology is not going to make the best leader. And people follow people, they don't follow titles. And so, if I think because so many in that particular generation of new leaders have had a very unique experience in their lives that if you can distinguish yourself through humanity, you will stand out. And it's the same advice that I would give anyone in that particular age group that there's a real opportunity to shine, and I think it's through humanity.
0:35:47.8 Jamie Enos: Well, Kathy, thank you so much for your time today. It is no surprise why you are nominated for the DGA Award and four dozen references came in on your behalf. An incredible story. I really enjoyed this conversation. Thank you so much for it. And we look forward to seeing you at West Point all through the fall as well through the winter and the spring and when you return for the class of 2026 to get your moment out on that plane and get that award in hand.
0:36:17.3 Kathleen Widmer: I'll be there as I'm always up there. But thanks, Jamie, for doing this. I think it's a great series and I really enjoy it. I really enjoy hearing from other leaders and other graduates. And this West Point has meant so much to me in my life that the opportunity to contribute in any way back means a lot to me at this point. And it's been a pleasure to be here.
0:36:41.2 Jamie Enos: Oh, that's great. And telling your story is one way to contribute. So, we do appreciate that. So thanks, Kathy.
0:36:46.6 Kathleen Widmer: My pleasure.
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